ok, granted, it's a small trivial thing, because crying over the top 50 is pretty lame

but the ballot stuffing seems to be getting a bit out of hand. i only noticed for matsujun and hana yori dango (yes, it's because i don't really like either), but i'm sure it's going on with a lot of the other jpop dramas or whatever you guys like to call them on here, JE? (what does that stand for anyways). all these people are registering with new accounts (feb and march 2006), and then posting once, and voting for jun and hyd. i mean it's just speculation, but my guess is that a lot of them are dupes. i understand everyone has their different tastes, and i don't fault people for liking either, but to cheat to get them up on the rankings is rather sad...

like i said before, it really isn't a big deal, and i don't know why i'm bothered by it at all. but maybe it's because when i started coming on here a couple years ago, i primarily used this place as a database... keep track of what i've seen, and get some insight on things that i might want to see in the future. i just think that over the past few months, a lot of that has gotten diluted. can you really trust a ranking that has jun pushing nanako for the #2 actor spot? i mean, i honestly don't expect anything to be done about it, and i'm still going to support the site regardless, since jdorama is an awesome database. but i just wanted to throw this potential problem out there, and see if anybody else has noticed it as well is all.

i do want to point out that this is, in no way, directed towards people that genuinely like jun and hyd. to each their own, you have your own tastes, and i respect that. i just wanted to start a discussion on possible ways to deter cheaters that make dupe accounts simply for the sake of stuffing ballots. maybe even something as simple as to only allow voting one month after registration? i dunno... anyone else feel the same way i do?

probably not haha

JE stands for johny's entertainment.

thank you man, i definitely feel you, i truly do. i've already spoke this on my behalf and had drama before regarding this, and not only for 2005 awards but in general as well, its just a pointless fight cuz people like me who arent into JE will never win hehe against all millions of matsugun fangirls all over the world so its just like whatevers. i got tired of it and moved on. not to worry, you're not alone.

and in fairness, its not like i dont like matsujun nor hyd, he is a great actor afterall, but i know someone better (no offense to his fans, and dont even trip) in fact im a big fan of the drama.
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gqstyle09 wrote:

i just wanted to start a discussion on possible ways to deter cheaters that make dupe accounts simply for the sake of stuffing ballots. maybe even something as simple as to only allow voting one month after registration? i dunno... anyone else feel the same way i do? probably not haha

I think no matter what the voting rules are, the outcomes will still be the same. It would take some time, but that's just how it'll be.

i do see your point cuz now that you mention it, gokusen and matsujun have been moving up in the rankings rather fast. not that i think gokusen was a bad drama or that matsujun is a bad actor or anything either but perhaps it has to do with the demographics shifting with more younger viewers watching. personally, i hope that once ppl have started to watch jdramas, they'll gradually be introduced to other series with and without JE actors and expand their horizons.

probably tho, as mixxdreamer and dochira mentioned, the outcome will likely be the same. i guess in a way, its sorta like an election, majority rules (and bush wins j/k) whether one likes it or not
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The entire Top 50 is a joke.

Until there are guidelines made to allow only legitimate members to vote and not allowing any schmuck off the street to cast a vote and disappear into the ether, ballot stuffing is gonna be the norm.

bmwracer wrote:

The entire Top 50 is a joke. Until there are guidelines made to allow only legitimate members to vote and not allowing any schmuck off the street to cast a vote and disappear into the ether, ballot stuffing is gonna be the norm.

Yeah, there should be a required number of posts (in other words, quota) before being able to vote in the top 50. There are many users who voted and didn't even make a single post .
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Saito_Hajime wrote:

Yeah, there should be a required number of posts (in other words, quota) before being able to vote in the top 50.

Sounds good to me.

Or have all legitimate members donate to the forum before they can vote.

Quote:

There are many users who voted and didn't even make a single post .

Way too many.

Most of the people on that b-day list have no more than a couple of posts.

bmwracer wrote:

Sounds good to me. Or have all legitimate members donate to the forum before they can vote.

Now that's a good one. It's like applying for a premium membership before able to vote

bmwracer wrote:

Way too many. Most of the people on that b-day list have no more than a couple of posts.

How about deleting those users who made 5 posts and below?
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Every system and set of rules will always lead to different ways of them being abused. So, personally, I would suggest we simply ignore the abusers and get on with what we want from this site - appreciation and discussion of Japanese drama/movies.

In any case these abuses are mainly from over-zealous fans who want to see the ranking of their favourite drama/artist shooting up. It screw things up if you are taking serious statistics from these figures to draw some kind of conclusion. Otherwise it is just a bother.

I think the suggestion of granting those who have sponsored this site voting right is good - after all a lot of time and resources went into maintaining this site and these efforts should be appreciated.

On the other hand I'm against the suggestion to delete users who posted less than a number of posts - a lot of members, me included, started out as lurkers. Voting is one thing but restricting access to those people is not quite right. A modification to the above suggestion will be to delete a member after his/her account has been inactive for a period of time, say, one year. This will give a chance for the lurkers to come out of there closets and start speaking up.

Just my 2 cents'...

I don't know how many post I've made so far, but I am a new member, but a long time user of this site.

I think it's natural to look at the to-50 and see some dramas that you didn't like and wonder why they are there if they were not that good. For instance, GTO is #1, but I didn't think it was that great (in spite of the title). The Top-50 is just a popularity contest. What people like wins out, not what's best -- and what people like can be as simple as seeing thier favorite in a show even of it's a bad one.

Of course, there is no way to stop it for all cases, but a minimum post requirement would not be bad. I'd recommend 20-30, not 5 since it's too easy to post "me, too" five times very quickly. Since I am still a newbie, such a recommdation would render me voiceless for a little while, but that's okay. I'll keep posting. It would not bother me at all since I like a good show no matter who is in it and I'll pan a bad show no matter who is in it, too (i.e. "Uso Koi").
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thtl wrote:

A modification to the above suggestion will be to delete a member after his/her account has been inactive for a period of time, say, one year. This will give a chance for the lurkers to come out of there closets and start speaking up.

this is exactly what i told to the admin before, but i forgot what he said cuz its such a long time ago i dont wanna bother him now cuz hes taking care of his new family. (congrats genma!)
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thtl wrote:

On the other hand I'm against the suggestion to delete users who posted less than a number of posts - a lot of members, me included, started out as lurkers. Voting is one thing but restricting access to those people is not quite right. A modification to the above suggestion will be to delete a member after his/her account has been inactive for a period of time, say, one year. This will give a chance for the lurkers to come out of there closets and start speaking up.

Hehe I knew there was a missing part in my sentence there. I forgot to mention about the period of time stuff . Yeah we should consider the date since when did a user join this forum before looking at his/her number of posts.

booniez wrote:

Of course, there is no way to stop it for all cases, but a minimum post requirement would not be bad. I'd recommend 20-30, not 5 since it's too easy to post "me, too" five times very quickly. Since I am still a newbie, such a recommdation would render me voiceless for a little while, but that's okay. I'll keep posting.

Yes of course 5 post is way too easy. I was just giving an idea there . Anyway, opinions and recommendations and stuff like that from a newbie is welcome here. Just speak your mind and keep posting .
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The conversation about purging sero-posters and posters who have disappear for over a year has been tossed around for a while now, but nothing has been done, for reasons unknown.

Guess we'll have to live with it and ignore those lists for now.

it'd be depressing to see only 100 members..

I think that it would not hurt anybody, if there are periodic purges of zero-post users that haven't been visiting the site for over a year. Not all at once, but maybe in groups of lets say 500-1000 users 2-3 times a year, thus the user mass wouldn't drop too fast. Also isn't it better for database to operate with less records?
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wow cool i leave for a few days, and a lot of productive banter ensues

i thought about all the ideas that you guys mentioned too. i think the reason i'm not so keen with the post count idea is because this site is unique in that there are two very major components to it, the forums and the database, rather than just the forums like a lot of other similar sites. so there are those, like me, who contribute constructive reviews (or not so constructive reviews haha) on a regular basis, but just don't forum hop as frequently, not that i don't like to do that once in awhile as well, i just don't have the time to do so a lot is all. but it is a good idea nonetheless.

the elimination of idle accounts is a very good idea, but i would base it on last login rather than last post for the above mentioned reasons. the only thing is that it doesn't really address the initial problem i brought up, namely the ballot stuffing accounts, until a year after the cheating occurs.

the paid member thing is also a very viable option, except that you really will only have like a hundred people or less who can vote hehe which actually may not be a bad thing... at least it would add some credibility to the rankings. but there are always those that really do care but just can't contribute at this time for some reason or another. personally, i'm living off $50,000 loans a year right now, so every dollar really does count. when i get my job after graduting next year, there will be many places, including jdorama, that i hope to be dishing out money to =)

the reason i thought the 'wait a month or two to vote' scheme might address the ballot stuffing problem the best is that those kids who have nothing better to do are probably just signing up, voting, and never touching the account ever again. if they had to wait a certain period of time before they could vote, most of them would probably have forgotten the account or even what their login was by the time they became eligible.

anyways... keep the discussion up, it's pretty interesting =) oh and thtl, i recognize that every system will be open to abuse, but you can always minimize it in some way, shape, or form. and since we have this suggestion forum, that's why i threw the idea out there in the first place. whether anything gets done about it or not really isn't paramount. like you said, i'm sure all of jdorama's members will move on with or without any changes, but change starts with recognizing and making people aware of a potential problem. that's really all i was trying to do. kinda spread the word and see what others thought about it. i was worried at first it would become one of those personal attack laced debates, but i was pleasantly surprised at the constructiveness of the thread when i checked it just now


edit: oh, and i forgot to add. this isn't really a question of who or what drama you personally think should be up there as compared to what is actually up there. i personally can't stand yonekura ryoko (sorry bmw ), but if she really is the most popular actress in japan, i wouldn't for one second have a problem with her being #1 in the rankings. it's more about being fair and reducing cheating if at all possible.

gqstyle09 wrote:

i personally can't stand yonekura ryoko (sorry bmw ), but if she really is the most popular actress in japan, i wouldn't for one second have a problem with her being #1 in the rankings. it's more about being fair and reducing cheating if at all possible.

Man, you're still holding a grudge against her for Pretty Girls, ne?


Guess we agree to disagree. As long as it's civil and not personal, I'm cool with it. *extends hand out to shake*

gqstyle09 wrote:

anyways... keep the discussion up, it's pretty interesting =) oh and thtl, i recognize that every system will be open to abuse, but you can always minimize it in some way, shape, or form. and since we have this suggestion forum, that's why i threw the idea out there in the first place. whether anything gets done about it or not really isn't paramount. like you said, i'm sure all of jdorama's members will move on with or without any changes, but change starts with recognizing and making people aware of a potential problem. that's really all i was trying to do. kinda spread the word and see what others thought about it. i was worried at first it would become one of those personal attack laced debates, but i was pleasantly surprised at the constructiveness of the thread when i checked it just now edit: oh, and i forgot to add. this isn't really a question of who or what drama you personally think should be up there as compared to what is actually up there. i personally can't stand yonekura ryoko (sorry bmw ), but if she really is the most popular actress in japan, i wouldn't for one second have a problem with her being #1 in the rankings. it's more about being fair and reducing cheating if at all possible.

Well, you opened the bag and let the cat out, so you'll have to cope with all the fur-balls...

The fact that you're not getting flamed for this rather controversial thread does seem to prove one point - those who participate in discussions tend to be more serious/mature (not the best choice of descriptions, feel free to use other words). Those who only joined to vote for their favourite drama/artist probably didn't even notice this thread. I fully agree with your comments on my comments (sic!) but I've been in too many alumni associations, committees etc. and have gotton cynical. Those who run the shop will try to run it as they see fit, views and suggestions are, sometimes, luxuries that may or may not get included for reasons that we'll never know.

BTW I've never understood Ms. Yonekura's popularity. IMHO see has a great package (face, body etc.) and not much else.

gqstyle09 wrote:

ok, granted, it's a small trivial thing, because crying over the top 50 is pretty lame

this has been brought up many times, by myself (and others i'm sure)...so your concerns are nothing new...if there is an action that takes place to address such concerns it would be welcome but in the larger scheme of things..it's a mere annoyance. the fact that jun matsumoto is ranked third is an utter farce and those that are discerning fans of japanese doramas will agree.

Then I agree.

Democracy doesn't work on this board. bmw, I'll support you if you want to do a coup d'etat and take over the top 50.
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