bmwracer wrote:

Particles??

the person is speaking in grammatical terms..."particles" such as "wa" ga" "de" "wo" "ni" etc.....



example:

Watashi wa bmwracer desu (I am bmwracer)

Nihon de takusan kirei na mono ga arimasu (In Japan, there are a lot of beautiful things)


Japanese grammar is a bitch

bmwracer wrote:

Particles??

Sure, Particles.

All kidding aside, particles like "wa" "wo" "ni" "de", etc. There are plenty of great examples (ala kokuou, supermidget, et al) in the Japanese Lang Lessons and Japanese Lang Questions threads.

Oh.

I dun know nuttin' 'bout no grammer.

bmwracer wrote:

Oh. I dun know nuttin' 'bout no grammer.

Nelly - Country Grammar.

i'm skerd.

dochira wrote:

Sure, Particles. All kidding aside, particles like "wa" "wo" "ni" "de", etc. There are plenty of great examples (ala kokuou, supermidget, et al) in the Japanese Lang Lessons and Japanese Lang Questions threads.

Thank you very much for link ^^
Yes, there are more particles xD is difficult >.< but I love Japanese

I merged the thread with this one, just to keep everything nice and tidy

To see an explanation of more particles, see the most recent pages (about 48 through 51) of this thread:

http://jdorama.com/viewtopic.304.960.htm

HTH,

������
_________________

There's much one can learn about particles, but I'll give you a short overview to get you started. By the way, some people call them 'particles' and other people use a different terminology, I forgot which one. Maybe 'grammatical markers'? or something. Okay here goes:


�� ga: subject marker
The word taking �� is the subject of the sentence and is the 'doer' of the verbs. It is also always used with question words like 'who' 'what' etc.
�O�l������! (gaijin ga iru) ~ There's a foreigner!
�N���D���� (kimi ga suki da) ~ I like you (litterally: you are likable)


��: topic marker
It's not the same or a replacement of ��, since �� can also mark objects and occur multiple times in one sentence. It's root translation would best be 'concerning', 'regarding', 'talking about', 'as far as ... is concerned'.

Examples make it clear:
���͓��{�l����Ȃ� (watashi wa nihonjin janai) ~ I'm not a Japanese (talking about me, i'm not japanese)

�� also has a nuance of contrasting to other things. For example:
�[���͔��������Ȃ� (nattou ha oishikunai) ~ nattou is not delicious... (but other things are) (litt: as far as nattou is concerned, it doesn't taste good)


��: time / movement ; direction / location marker / agent marker
�X�[�p�[�ɍs�� (suupaa ni iku) ~ going to the supermarket
�Ƃɂ��� (ie ni iru) ~ being in the house
���ɏ��� (kami ni kaku) ~ writing on a paper
���q�ɂ��ׂ��� (shishi ni taberareru) ~ being eaten by a lion
�X���ɍs���@(kuji ni iku) ~ going at 9

��: area marker (for things happening around a place, instead of being a movement towards that place) / 'tool' marker
�M�ŏ��� (fude de kaku) ~ writing with a brush
������� (kouen de aruku) ~ walking at/around/in the park


��: object marker
�ꂳ���҂� (kaasan wo matsu) ~ waiting for my mother (litt: awaiting my mother)
�ʐ^���B�� (shashin wo toru) ~ taking a picture

��: direction
translated litterally by 'towards', not implying reaching the destination
�k�֗��s���� (kita he ryokou suru) ~ travelling to the north
�X�[�p�[�֍s�� (suupaa he iku) ~ going to(wards) the supermarket

��: too, also, as well, 'even'
�l���s���񂾂� (boku mo iku n da yo) ~ I'm going too, you know!
�r�[��������H (biiru mo aru?) ~ is there also beer?
����C�����Ȃ��� (iya, mizu mo nai wa) ~ no, there's not even water
�X�y�C������ł��邻���ł� (speingo mo dekiru sou desu) ~ it seems she can even speak (understand/do) spanish

��: possive particle; 's (litterally: of)
�Ԃ̃h�A (kuruma no doa) ~ the door of the car (the car's door)
�������̏L�� (hikari-chan no nioi) ~ hikari's fragrant
���Ȃ��̂������� (anata no otousan) ~ your father (litt: the father of you)

��: and, with (not to join sentences); quotative particle
�N�Ɩl�̗� (kimi to boku no koi) ~ Our love (litterally: the love of you and I)
�p���ƃ`�[�Y�𔃂� (pan to cheezu wo kau) ~ buying bread and cheese
���ƗV�� (inu to asobu) ~ playing (together) with the dog

�n���ƌ��� (baka to iu) ~ saying "baka"
�X�[�p�[�~�[�b�g�Ɛ\���܂� (suupaamizetto to mooshimasu) ~ I'm supermidget (litt: I call (myself) supermidget)
�ǂ��s���ƌ��� (doko iku to iu) ~ saying "where are you going?"

�܂�: until
�ǂ��܂ōs���́H (doko made iku no?) ~ how far are you going (until where are you going?)
���É��܂ōs���@(nagoya made iku) ~ i'm going till nagoya

����: from
������o����S (hako kara dete kuru oni) ~ the devil that comes out from a box (I don't remember what it means, it's a proverb or something in my country. maybe also english??? lol)
�؍�����̗F�B (kankoku kara no tomodachi) ~ a friend from korea (litt: a friend of from korea)

hmm i guess there's many more... like �� (used like �� to say 'and' but is translated by 'this and this and this etcetera). Well hope this is enough for a start. If you've any questions feel free to post them. Good luck!

ps: to others; please correct my post if i made mistakes.
_________________

supermidget wow great explanation!!!!!!!!!!!!
Doumo arigatou gozaimasu!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you supermidget
I'm saving this one.

I'm glad it's useful

The best way to test your knowledge of the particles is trying to make sentences like:
"I'm going with my parents to my brother's school by car, at 10 o'clock".

to give a hint:
"by car" -> the car is a 'tool' so to speak
_________________

supermidget wrote:

I'm glad it's useful The best way to test your knowledge of the particles is trying to make sentences like: "I'm going with my parents to my brother's school by car, at 10 o'clock". to give a hint: "by car" -> the car is a 'tool' so to speak

����Ă݂�c

�������e���P�O�����������Z�������w�Z�������񂾁B

EDIT: Underlined particles

vega12 wrote:

����Ă݂�c �������e���P�O�����������Z�������w�Z�������񂾁B EDIT: Underlined particles

You missed the comma after �� (a �u�A�v is usually inserted after the 'wa' when the subject comes first in a sentence), but other than that, the grammar is 100% PERFECT!

Great job, really

������
_________________

"I like the word 'indolence'. It makes my laziness seem classy."
-Bern Williams

vega12 wrote:

����Ă݂�c �������e���P�O�����������Z�������w�Z�������񂾁B EDIT: Underlined particles

���߂łƂ��������܂� omedetou gozaimasu
^_^ Well done
_________________

�@
�Y�����s������

wow! i just begin to learn japanese this year at the singapore MOE language centre... u all are so good at it! impressive! i understood the sentence above mentioned but about the �������� part, i always thought that it was �֍s���܂��B can someone just explain that little bit?

supermidget wrote:

There's much one can learn about particles, but I'll give you a short overview to get you started. By the way, some people call them 'particles' and other people use a different terminology, I forgot which one. Maybe 'grammatical markers'? or something. Okay here goes: �� ga: subject marker The word taking �� is the subject of the sentence and is the 'doer' of the verbs. It is also always used with question words like 'who' 'what' etc. �O�l������! (gaijin ga iru) ~ There's a foreigner! �N���D���� (kimi ga suki da) ~ I like you (litterally: you are likable) ��: topic marker It's not the same or a replacement of ��, since �� can also mark objects and occur multiple times in one sentence. It's root translation would best be 'concerning', 'regarding', 'talking about', 'as far as ... is concerned'. Examples make it clear: ���͓��{�l����Ȃ� (watashi wa nihonjin janai) ~ I'm not a Japanese (talking about me, i'm not japanese) �� also has a nuance of contrasting to other things. For example: �[���͔��������Ȃ� (nattou ha oishikunai) ~ nattou is not delicious... (but other things are) (litt: as far as nattou is concerned, it doesn't taste good) ��: time / movement ; direction / location marker / agent marker �X�[�p�[�ɍs�� (suupaa ni iku) ~ going to the supermarket �Ƃɂ��� (ie ni iru) ~ being in the house ���ɏ��� (kami ni kaku) ~ writing on a paper ���q�ɂ��ׂ��� (shishi ni taberareru) ~ being eaten by a lion �X���ɍs���@(kuji ni iku) ~ going at 9 ��: area marker (for things happening around a place, instead of being a movement towards that place) / 'tool' marker �M�ŏ��� (fude de kaku) ~ writing with a brush �����ŕ��� (kouen de aruku) ~ walking at/around/in the park ��: object marker �ꂳ���҂� (kaasan wo matsu) ~ waiting for my mother (litt: awaiting my mother) �ʐ^���B�� (shashin wo toru) ~ taking a picture ��: direction translated litterally by 'towards', not implying reaching the destination �k�֗��s���� (kita he ryokou suru) ~ travelling to the north �X�[�p�[�֍s�� (suupaa he iku) ~ going to(wards) the supermarket ��: too, also, as well, 'even' �l���s���񂾂� (boku mo iku n da yo) ~ I'm going too, you know! �r�[��������H (biiru mo aru?) ~ is there also beer? ����C�����Ȃ��� (iya, mizu mo nai wa) ~ no, there's not even water �X�y�C������ł��邻���ł� (speingo mo dekiru sou desu) ~ it seems she can even speak (understand/do) spanish ��: possive particle; 's (litterally: of) �Ԃ̃h�A (kuruma no doa) ~ the door of the car (the car's door) �������̏L�� (hikari-chan no nioi) ~ hikari's fragrant ���Ȃ��̂������� (anata no otousan) ~ your father (litt: the father of you) ��: and, with (not to join sentences); quotative particle �N�Ɩl�̗� (kimi to boku no koi) ~ Our love (litterally: the love of you and I) �p���ƃ`�[�Y�𔃂� (pan to cheezu wo kau) ~ buying bread and cheese ���ƗV�� (inu to asobu) ~ playing (together) with the dog �n���ƌ��� (baka to iu) ~ saying "baka" �X�[�p�[�~�[�b�g�Ɛ\���܂� (suupaamizetto to mooshimasu) ~ I'm supermidget (litt: I call (myself) supermidget) �ǂ��s���ƌ��� (doko iku to iu) ~ saying "where are you going?" �܂�: until �ǂ��܂ōs���́H (doko made iku no?) ~ how far are you going (until where are you going?) ���É��܂ōs���@(nagoya made iku) ~ i'm going till nagoya ����: from ������o�Ă���S (hako kara dete kuru oni) ~ the devil that comes out from a box (I don't remember what it means, it's a proverb or something in my country. maybe also english??? lol) �؍�����̗F�B (kankoku kara no tomodachi) ~ a friend from korea (litt: a friend of from korea) hmm i guess there's many more... like �� (used like �� to say 'and' but is translated by 'this and this and this etcetera). Well hope this is enough for a start. If you've any questions feel free to post them. Good luck! ps: to others; please correct my post if i made mistakes.

erms.. sorry to interrupt but are you using the �����Y? i mean the dictionary form of the verbs if i got it wrong?

kiimura+akuya wrote:

wow! i just begin to learn japanese this year at the singapore MOE language centre... u all are so good at it! impressive! i understood the sentence above mentioned but about the �������� part, i always thought that it was �֍s���܂��B can someone just explain that little bit?

The difference between �� (he) and �� (ni) is that �� ni implies a clear destination, while �� he only describes a direction. In daily use it often doesn't matter so much which you use. I often imagine someone pointing at his/her exact target when thinking of the particle �� ni. Not that I usually dream about particles, but you know...
_________________

�@
�Y�����s������

kiimura+akuya wrote:

erms.. sorry to interrupt but are you using the �����Y? i mean the dictionary form of the verbs if i got it wrong?

If by dictionary form, you mean rentaikei, then yes I used them. What exactly is your point?

In case you ask why I didn't use -masu forms or past tenses; it's because I want to keep it as simple as possible. It's about the particles here, not about the verbs.

Ps: when you quote a long post, it might be better to cut it off a bit so the page doesn't get filled up so much.
_________________

�@
�Y�����s������

oh ok ok... i get it... thnkxx... and so sorry for the long "quote"... so sorry... really...

oh ya... i'm also sorry about that error there (the dictionary form in japanese)... it's because my teacher always says it as jishokei... i guess i'm just a bit dizzy... so it should be rentaikei... oh... ok so sorry...

sorry again... is it �A�̌`?